Secular Jihadists EP40: ISIS Ex-Wife Speaks…


“I knew what jihad meant. When Bin Laden spoke about jihad, it made sense to me.” Tania Joya was married to the highest-ranking American in ISIS, John Georgelas (also known as Yahya Al-Bahrumi or Abu Hasan), currently believed to be in Syria. She is the mother of their four children. She joins us for a jaw-dropping two-hour conversation, taking us through her childhood growing up as a Bangladeshi-British girl who became radicalized after 9/11. She discusses all the factors that led to her radicalization, her subsequent marriage to John, her incredible travels in some of the world’s most dangerous spots in Egypt and Syria, her interactions with other ISIS soldiers, and finally, how and why she left her marriage, Syria, ISIS, and Islam. We also spoke about the reaction Westerners have to her—ranging from appreciation to distrust and wanting her punished, her conflicted feelings about her ex-husband, and that infamous Piers Morgan interview. Tania is whip-smart, insightful, and impossible to not listen to.



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Secular Jihadists

Who would you like us to invite as a guest?

Easybakeoven 21

Pisses me off man my dad,grandad,great grandad etc all paid taxes which part of that money builds the country up they all worked hard for the next generation and then the government lets people in to have views like this it’s ridiculous I’m fed up with it i was born in London They talk of multiculturalism but it’s the complete opposite i can’t walk around certain area of east London and feel safe not that I want to because there’s nothing English about that area anymore

ravi kashyap

Really sad to hear that she considers to have only a 40 yr old history!!! Bangladesh, Pakistan, India have a shared history. This is what Islam does , it kills ethnic history and cultures. Bengalis have rich history of thousands of years , they are real hero’s in ending the British Colonial Rule . the Indian civilization dates further than all Abrahamic religions. But the moment you introduce ISLAM it’s like a reset. No words to express my frustration.

Laurelin Doty

This was a great interview! I sympathize with her feelings of exhaustion and thinking god asked too much of her. I felt the same, though no doubt to a lesser degree, before I left Christianity.

Ravi Kulkarni

All this discussion of Syria, but no talk of American interference historically which has led to the current situation.


She strikes me as an opportunist


Did she seriously liken donald trumps opposition to mass immigration to the rape of yazidi children and beheading? What an awful, awful thing to say. If she is so committed to ideals of internationalism why not come live in England where you couldn't get any further away than trumps America? Oh yeah, she'd fear for her life.


It's staggering, when she casually says, 'oh yeah the salafi Algerians who came in as refugees'. Why are the 'leaders' of Western Europe actively putting native Western Europeans in harms way and facilitating the expansion of this death cult? I remember being at school after 9/11, I never really questioned the Pakistani pupils sharing beheading videos. It was the first time I heard people declare Europeans deserve to die. These were early, lower quality videos than the Isis material, so god knows what children are watching today. I know that if I reported them, my school would have been too… Read more »

Jim King

Captivating podcast. Tania is an odd mix of intelligence, past naivete, and strong and engaging personality. What a wild story.

Ali Vazirabad

remove mohammad substitute ron paul, I like it

Mary Hudson

So glad you're at 2.5K.  I was number 40!


Will you do an episode on circumcision?

hazem ameen

Please bring Imtiaz Shams on the podcast.

Kata Khresis

Fascinating but she’s still spreading pro-ISIS/US propaganda about Assad regime.

Karan Desai

How do you guys not have more subscribers???!!!!

Dutch Skeptic

What an incredible story!

The Ocelot

What languages does Ali speak?